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I love Joss Whedon!

  • Dec. 12th, 2007 at 12:23 AM
Heartstrings/VM/Logan
Yes, I know he isn’t perfect. But I don’t care. Also, this is like a year old, and I’ve heard about it, but I just stumbled over this full list and it made my day. My tiring, difficult, sleep-deprived, headache-inducing, grumbley day. Humor me.

Basically, last year, on Whedonesque, Joss made a list of his Top 25 favorite TV characters. In response to James Gunn’s ditto. Don’t know James Gunn, don’t give a hoot, just want to giggle over Whedon’s list:

Hi! Remember me? I don't. But I think I have something to do with writing stuff, or writing ABOUT stuff -- I might be a food critic. I'm pretty critical about food, so that's probably it.

Anywhy, I couldn't look at Mr Gunn's nice list without suddenly being compelled to make one of my own. What is it about lists? Are they like soft-shell crab with a mango coulis, where... actually I don't know where that's heading. Possibly to ADVENTURE! I made a list.

Following James' rules, but also adding a "no shows of my own" clause, here's the first awesome 25 I could come up with. Let the debate be debatey! (oh, also I'm not bothering to spell check, IMDB, or ask anyone about things I only partially remember. So best of luck knowing what the hell I'm typing about.) In no particular order:

1) #6. (See, it really is no particular order, or this would be about 5 later.) Patrick McGoohan retaining ultimate cool in the face of existential, Kalfka-esque shenanigans and a giant floating Blancmange.

2) George Michael Bluth. Arrested Development is impossible to choose from, but the buttoned-down kid is usually the character I can't stand and George Michael is frikkin' adorable. Poor little guy. (Joss, yeay!)

3) Does anybody remember the desperate last-minute revamp of Beauty and the Beast? Where they got all thrillery, killed Linda Hamilton and replaced her with Jo Anderson as a sort of female Will Graham (before half the characters on TV were sort of female Will Grahams-- before, in fact, Clarisse Starling)? Well she was awesome. Cool, and wicked beautiful, and being stalked by Lance Henriksen as a guy named "Snow"! The stuff of life! Show died in a month. (Ahahaha!)

4) Belzer from Hill Street Blues. Guy could not partner with anyone who didn't die. The actor, the wannabe hero, the 'tard, the nice lady -- they were all meat for the Belzergrinder. I don't care how repetitive it was -- he was feral, funny and human. Eating out of a can on X-mas, getting a call -- that's a wrong number -- and never for a moment feeling sorry for himself. Wow. I feel sorry for myself all the time, and I eat from very fancy cans. (I repeat: ahahahaha!)

5) Josh Lyman from the West Wing. Another 'throw a stone, hit a favorite', but Josh has a thing. That thing is called Donna. (Joss, for that alone, I can kiss you right now! But wait, more’s to come!)

6) Ed Asner in any show featuring Lou Grant. Solid, baby. Oh, I'll just slide my character from high comedy to high drama like people do all the time. What's that you say? Well, surely very often, yes? No?

7) Gordon Jackson: Mr. Hudson the Butler in Upstairs Downstairs. The avatar of cool, except in that late episode where they made him cry over some young woman which was entirely unseemly.

8) Lisa Kudrow as Phoebe on Friends. Yeah, backlash etc., but that was one of the best written shows ever for a spell and when it was, she could not miss. Really unique.

9) President Stands-With-A-Fist from Battlestar Galactica. The role she was born for. (Hell, yeah! Laura Roslin! You tell ‘em, Joss! And how funny is "President Stands-With-A-Fist!?). You wanna go head to head with Edward James Almos? Perhaps you don't remember what a bad-ass he was on Miami Vice. So bad-ass, in fact, that he's…

10) … so there.

11) Rod Serling on the Twilight Zone. He wasn't a character per se, he was just TV at its finest and smoking at its coolest.

12) Quincy M.D. Or my wife will divorce me. But also, yeah. (Ha!)

13) Logan from Veronica Mars. Smirking his way into TV history. (OMG, Joss! This?! This deserves my undying devotion! You know, if you didn’t have it already. LOL. And a resounding "HELL, YEAH!").

14) The (American) Office is another throw-a-stone, but I'm giving it up for Jim, 'cause I've watched that scene between him and Pam in the season 2 finale like 17 times and his readings are smooth like booze. Also, he's the person in that scene who's not married to James Gunn, so I can rant and nobody gets freaked. (I fear James as I fear few things.) (LOL. Maybe I should find out who James Gunn is. If he scares Joss, he must be something. Also, yeay for Jim making the list! The boy is lovely.).

15) Agent Dale Cooper. 'Cause pie. (Ahahahahaha! "’Cause pie!" And ‘cause Dale Cooper kicked all sort of ass!)

16) Finola Hughes, Anna Devane on General Hospital. Why does she flirt with me so?

17) Jonathan Banks in Wiseguy. Here's a guy doomed to play heavies in movies like "Freejack" -- throw some wire-rimmed glasses on him and he becomes the coolest man on the tube. (3rd use of 'cool'. This is clearly important to me, this 'cool'.) While Ken Wahl lost his mind and gained his weight, Banks anchored the show from first to last. Indelible.

18) Unfrozen Caveman Lawyer. This may be stretching the rules, but your modern world frightens and confuses me and he's on the damn list. (I may be overusing this, but … Ahahahaha!)

19) Kristie MacNichol on Family. Early crush. Can't remember much more.

20) That car rental guy from Veronica Ma… -- oh this is too cheesy even for me. Columbo. (Joss, you are killing me!)

21) Bea Arthur as Maude. Or in anything ever. But mostly Maude.

22) Jerry Orbach in Law and Order. I hated the obligatory wisecrack, but Jerry is New York personified (and a Broadway Hoofer) and as real as it gets...

23) ...Unless it gets to Dennis Farina in Crime Story, who actually WAS a cop before he started acting. Tough guy, great cars, what-a-show. The bad guy gets nuked. NUKED.

24) Dick Van Dyke. He's diagnosing... murder! Also I think he had a sitcom. (I can’t help it: Ahahahaha!)

25) House. If you saw him in Blackadder, even more so, but if you haven't, House. The last great humanist. (OMG, "the last great humanist!" I’m dying here!)

'Kay. That's that then. First off, what's up with all the cops? Even Finola on GenHo was Chief of Police. Second, I reserve the right to wake up tomorrow and scream bloody murder at remembering the 25 I actually like much better. In fact, I think I'll do it now. BLOODY MURRDERRRR!!!!!

I feel better. Back to work, Crachitt.

-Joss. …

Thank you for the laugh, and for some great choices!

Comments

[info]earth2mars wrote:
Dec. 12th, 2007 05:39 am (UTC)
How could anyone NOT love JW. :) While I recognize nearly everyone on this list--it's only by name. I was too young to really appreciate these shows when they were on. However, I want to hug JW for his love of Logan and it makes me hope that if Moonlight fails and Dollhouse succeeds, he'll keep JDo in mind.

I believe James Gunn's real claim to fame is being divorced from Jenna Fischer and being Gilmore Girls' Kirk's (Sean Gunn's) brother. He's done some film work but nothing spectacular if memory serves.
[info]hiddeneloise wrote:
Dec. 12th, 2007 04:18 pm (UTC)
How could anyone NOT love JW?

LOL. Reminds me of this woman on CSI (one of the funny episodes they do sometimes) asking with completely mystified air: "Who would hate a pediatric nurse?"

I'm sure there are people who don't like Joss (or, rather, his work). I'm more than sure there are those who are completely indifferent to him. As they say, if you're waiting for the universal approbation, you'll be sitting here a very long time. :)) What was that joke about a guy somewhere in Calcutta, at a bar, going: "You know that Gandhi dude? He is a total prick!" LOL.

But all that matters here is that we love Joss and his sense of humor, and, it appears, his choice of favorite characters! :)))

I want to hug JW for his love of Logan and it makes me hope that if Moonlight fails and Dollhouse succeeds, he'll keep JDo in mind.

I would LOVE for JD to work with Joss. However, a few things. It's too early to say yet, and I never say it until I hear the official statement from the network, but it looks like Moonlight is staying. It did well with the demos, better than 90 percent of the new shows this year, and that's what CBS is looking at. We'll see. Thing number 2: Joss' "Dollhouse" is going to be on FOX. Which isn't exactly known for nurturing quality shows. It doesn't give them enough time to build an audience. It doesn't even care about critical buzz or whatever. "Arrested Development" being the exception, and even that had more or less decent ratings, compared to, say, "Firefly." So, the odds of "Dollhouse" making it are not good. Then again, who knows. It could explode into a huge ratings bonanza. I'd be shocked, but I am not ruling it out 100 percent. I just wish Joss would work with CW. I know, not a quality network, but it's a small one, and the kind of numbers anything by Whedon would bring would be considered a resounding success. Plus it'll bring the press, and CW needs that. Oh, well,

Thanks for explaining James Gunn. So, he is a screen writer. I looked up his credits and I'm still completely mystified why Joss'd be afraid of him. Even as a joke. But it's clearly an inside joke, so, I'm not supposed to get it. LOL.
[info]stephanierb wrote:
Dec. 12th, 2007 05:06 pm (UTC)

However, I want to hug JW for his love of Logan and it makes me hope that if Moonlight fails and Dollhouse succeeds, he'll keep JDo in mind.

I would be in heaven if Joss Whedon and Jason Dohring worked together. I don't see it happening with this next project, but there's always hope for the future.
[info]skyroom80 wrote:
Dec. 12th, 2007 07:01 am (UTC)
He got almost every one of my favorites! Oh, Joss! Of course, JD would be the first great choice. But, but ..."President "Stands With a Fist!" Oh, man! I may have to find and repost this one. Laura Roslin is my favorite BSG character.

Kristy McNicholl on "Family!" And wow, does that age me. So does Agent Dale Cooper, but -- would TV be the same today without "Twin Peaks?" Just sayin'.

This is just the greatest list.
[info]hiddeneloise wrote:
Dec. 12th, 2007 04:06 pm (UTC)
Here's the link:

Joss' Top 25

And I know! I had to squee over President Roslin, Josh Lyman (with shout-out to Donna!), Jim, and, hell yeah! on Agent Dale Cooper (circa Season 1). But the fact that he included Logan... I have no words! :)
[info]sophisti_girl wrote:
Dec. 12th, 2007 07:35 am (UTC)
I remember this list! Half of it I was like, "Who?" The other half "YES!" I love Joss. I can't wait for Doll House (please FOX don't F this up too).

I was really excited to see Logan on there, which just made the butchering of the character in season three that much more painful for me = (
[info]hiddeneloise wrote:
Dec. 12th, 2007 04:23 pm (UTC)
please FOX don't F this up too).

Yeah. I have a sick feeling about it. Sigh. We'll see.

which just made the butchering of the character in season three that much more painful for me

At least his descent into the depressed state made emotional sense. What was painful to watch was complete disintegration of Veronica's character as someone worth caring about. And it wasn't just the writing. Kristen Bell had stripped her performance sympathetic qualities almost entirely, of practically all vulnerability, and pretty much any relatable warmth. That was what killed it for me. Sigh.
[info]midnight_27 wrote:
Dec. 12th, 2007 01:18 pm (UTC)
Joss is awesome, I recognize some of the names on the list and he definitely got major points for including Logan, smirking his way is right. I think James G. did a movie or something with Nathan Fillion to add to the list of what the person said above on who James G. is.

I know some people don't like Joss but I never really got the story behind that. Nonetheless, I can't wait for his return to television.
[info]hiddeneloise wrote:
Dec. 12th, 2007 04:26 pm (UTC)
Yeah, I heard the story of something to do with Charisma. Or maybe it was something else. I'm not defending anything or anyone, I just don't know enough for that. I'm sure he isn't perfect and I am not shocked there are situations where he comes off less-than. That's pretty much a given with humans. I simply love his ramblings and his choices. Oh, and his shows, of course. LOL.

Thank you for the James G. tidbit. I'll have to go look it up now! I love Nathan! :)

[info]midnight_27 wrote:
Dec. 13th, 2007 01:45 am (UTC)
A very diplomatic answer and I agree with your stance.

I adore Nathan as well but even I could not watch Desperate Housewives. I still haven't checked out 'Waitress' but hopefully soon.

What you wrote above regarding Fox not nurturing shows is very true. They canceled Drive after 4 episodes I believe and it was just starting to pick up pace.
[info]hiddeneloise wrote:
Dec. 13th, 2007 02:54 am (UTC)
LOL. Diplomatic. That's me. :)) Honestly, I really don't know any dirt. I heard stuff, but it was all rather vague. Hard to form an opinion either way.

I bit the bullet and watched NF on Desperate Housewives. Sigh. Not much to that part. Maybe it'll get better. On the other hand, I can't wait to see "Waitress." I've got it on my list on Netflix, so I should get it soon. :)

And I am so annoyed with Fox for canceling Drive like that! They have stuck it in at an odd season, gave it 4 episodes and then axed it. I thought it had potential, and different stories to tell, and interesting characters, and a compelling mystery. Figures. These days I'm petrified to like something new on TV. I don't even check out shows until they get picked up for at least one full season. Too many times I'd get attached only to have it taken away. LOL. Which is why I'm telling myself not to get excited about Dollhouse. :) Who needs another heartbreak?!
[info]midnight_27 wrote:
Dec. 13th, 2007 05:17 pm (UTC)
I thought Nathan was absolutely amazing as the multifaceted Captain Mal for Firefly/Serenity and later as Caleb for BtVS. I thought the whole cast for the Firefly/Serenity verse was lovely so I'm happy to see some of them back on television. I started to watch Chuck because Alec B (Janye) was in it and I'm enjoying it so far. I agree, I do not like watching new shows because of the fear of canceling. Plus, I hate how the audience is left hanging, I wanted answers for Drive. That is why I was extremely happy we got Serenity, yes there are still some questions left unanswered but at least we are left with a better ending/new beginning for our heroes.

If Nathan and JD ever work together for a Joss show I will be extremely happy. :)
[info]stephanierb wrote:
Dec. 12th, 2007 05:10 pm (UTC)

I have to say, I've had some issues with Joss Whedon in the past with some of his writing choices on BtVS, but I still think he's crazy talented and I'm VERY excited about Dollhouse. From what I understand, Joss is excited as well. He's had a bad taste in his mouth vis-a-vis Fox since they canceled Firefly, but in an interview, he seemed positive about Fox developing this new project. I guess we'll see.

Anyway, there are not enough words to say how much I LOVE Joss for including Logan in his list. I hope he does keep JD in mind for future projects, because that would be a match made in heaven.
[info]hiddeneloise wrote:
Dec. 13th, 2007 02:43 am (UTC)
I've had my share of issues with the writing choices on both BtVS and Angel. I'm sure I would have had them with Firefly as well, had that lasted longer than 13 episodes. LOL. Thing is, you are right: he is crazy talented. And I may not love everything he does, but what I do love, I love utterly. :)

I'm glad he is positive about Fox. Maybe they'll give him a decent shot, instead of expecting huge numbers right out of the gate. Fox isn't known for its patience, but who knows. Wait and see is all we can do. And man, if Joss hires JD for -- I don't even care what, I'll watch anything Joss-made -- I'll be ecstatic! :))

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